Against the Run with Asad Raza: The Football Stories We Remember

00:00:04: They want a break from the noise and they want to be reminded of the purity of game that fell in love with it, right?

00:00:10: They want joy.

00:00:12: A good magazine piece should always take you to unexpected places.

00:00:17: I think is mounted out two screens And i think The online ecosystem encourages reactionary being vitriolic Being like fuck you Fuck You Fuck You.

00:00:47: Hello and welcome back to Against The Run, the one-on-one conversation series.

00:00:50: bystands initiated In a twenty-twenty six stands once again brings together people at the Milan tour who see football as more than just game.

00:01:03: They understand it is a cultural space between streetwear, design music subculture social conviction and of course to communities connecting.

00:01:11: these worlds end.

00:01:13: in this podcast we meet people do not simply consume culture but actively shaped.

00:01:18: We talk about the experiences and communities that shape them, The work they do.

00:01:22: The values stand for And moments when they consciously chose not to simply follow the crowd.

00:01:29: My name is Amadius Tuna.

00:01:30: Once again I have pleasure of guiding you through next few minutes as your host and resident subculture connoisseur.

00:01:37: My guest today is Asad Raza, editor-in-chief of Mundial.

00:01:41: The independent magazine that reminds people why they love football through stories about supporters

00:01:46: shirts

00:01:47: and places travel and culture And all of this around the game.

00:01:52: we all love football as it's great to have you here

00:01:56: A pleasure to be her.

00:01:57: what a fantastic intro That was couldn't done by myself.

00:02:00: Thanks appreciate And I already talked to you before we started recording this episode.

00:02:04: that have the working title for our interview called Why Football Steel Needs Magazines.

00:02:10: But, Before We Get Into That... I can't

00:02:12: wait for a new title which would be why football should have more iPads!

00:02:16: That's nice one as well.

00:02:18: but before we get into it..we have like an opening question and i ask all of my guests when do they realize no longer want to just consume culture?

00:02:29: but start to be actively having apartments?

00:02:33: I mean, i've always wanted to actively be a part of it.

00:02:38: In terms just from reading about football or in terms like magazine articles... ...I always want it to be a writer and tell stories which again sounds very job-interviewy But its true!

00:02:52: I could never envisage being passive person in my relationship with the things I love, i think football is one of those things and writing as another making magazines.

00:03:03: Having had the opportunity to make magazine for a living it's amazing like yeah its just...I always knew that I wanted to do that.

00:03:16: Does this answer your question?

00:03:20: It does definitely but I was thinking about.

00:03:24: you said you have an opportunity to do a magazine.

00:03:27: what exactly means?

00:03:28: Well, as in I was just talking about being like hired by Mundi.

00:03:33: All right?

00:03:33: I was approached to write when I was quite young much younger than I am now for your gray hairs but you know.

00:03:40: uh i was approached by the former features of James Byrd or two.

00:03:44: um Write a youth football profile About like the best women's footballers at the euros At the twenty-twenty-two euros and I wrote feature of then, they were like I'll pitch us and then i pitched them a very silly article.

00:04:01: And there was oh would you like a job?

00:04:02: And I said yes!

00:04:03: Contrary to what I just said where I always wanted to create...I did but.. ..I never really knew that it's going be journalist in this way so its kind of falling into it all the sudden got on her.

00:04:15: best magazines in my opinion in the world.

00:04:19: dream come true.

00:04:21: Yeah, getting to learn how just fall in love with the craft of making something like that was super cool.

00:04:29: We already know you love doing magazines but what would say is the plus for an independent magazine in comparison to a broadcaster club channel or social platform?

00:04:42: Well there's many things and one we can... specifically with print, but just also gin it more generally the stories that we tell.

00:04:50: It's like... We can afford to be more patient with things and go longer or go deeper or spend months at a football club in Wales for example.

00:04:58: Or you know go to Amsterdam to interview designer about their bootleg vintage shirts, you know We have that quality of taking well to put it into football terms.

00:05:10: Taking a touch.

00:05:11: basically we can take a touch and we could pause And we can decide what stories matter?

00:05:16: To us.

00:05:17: What stories do our fans respond too?

00:05:20: because then the people who tend to read Mundial or consume social media content Or listen to whatever podcast remake they are People in my mind at least.

00:05:31: there are people.

00:05:33: I want that considered element.

00:05:34: They won't a break from the noise and they want to be reminded of the purity Of The Game That They Fell in Love with, right?

00:05:40: You Want Joy And There Can Be Doom & Gloom.

00:05:44: We've Had Some Very Serious Investigations As Well But At The Whole Ethos Especially My Like Direction To The Magazine Is To Restore People's Joy When Reading Watching Thinking Off Of All.

00:05:56: So Why Would you Say Does A Magazine Still Matter?

00:06:00: I think print matters because it's something you can like tangibly hold in your hands and be, this is several people have spent months making this reality.

00:06:08: And its full of...I'm a print maximalist so i want my printed objects to have a sense for the personality or the person who made them So alot over here In Mundiar's case.

00:06:19: very irreverent tone of voice Very fun big bold design All these things.

00:06:30: You almost can use them kind of like as a coffee table book, right?

00:06:34: Yeah.

00:06:34: So it's not just the magazine Like back in the days you bought your buy a magazine you read

00:06:37: and throw away.

00:06:39: We're trying to create artifacts that people couldn't keep coming back to collect them yeah collectibles.

00:06:43: And also like yeah, you could put on your coffee table.

00:06:47: People come around be like oh what stars are.

00:06:48: you don't know when Mundial is but It start.

00:06:54: I think isn't antidote to screens, if you're constantly... I've got loads of just news apps on my phone.

00:07:02: You can be doing that but how much are you actively engaging in?

00:07:06: How is it going and lost the ruins memory like when you read a great piece in a printed magazine?

00:07:14: A couple months ago i read about The History Of Milk In New York.

00:07:18: I would never have thought about reading that.

00:07:22: If someone was like do want to read about history milk But because a good magazine piece should always take you to unexpected places, not always.

00:07:31: but that's the benefit of doing Magazine Articles.

00:07:35: I then discovered something i didn't know and be interested in.

00:07:37: so there is all these different things... ...but it allows me just being more intentional with your choices which i think is appealing for people

00:07:46: Doing deep dives having more things you can discover learning not only about the topic and.

00:07:54: You can learn about the writer as well is something which I really, really adore.

00:07:59: when we talk in about magazines and longer articles stuff like that.

00:08:04: but i could imagine that when you approaching a firm company football club these days maybe they would like more tend to having reach and clicks, an engagement on followers.

00:08:19: And all these KPIs we are talking about.

00:08:21: so is it more complicated these days?

00:08:24: To really pitch something like a magazine... Like a printed magazine I would

00:08:28: say yes or no.

00:08:30: i was going to say also We don't just do long form in the magazine.. We do shorter pieces at the front which are very funny and silly or stupid.

00:08:38: that carries over into our social presence.

00:08:40: It's also like we balance the magazine with more online content.

00:08:45: Maybe that's a written interview, maybe that is A video made for football club like Mundial Balances print digital audio and social media And we're doing more of it because more of It Is required.

00:08:58: but I think actually in terms Of when you go to football clubs they are More receptive To.

00:09:03: every football club wants to be in print Because it'd Be easier For us to do it on digital.

00:09:08: We have to be selective About who will put In the magazine.

00:09:11: You only Have certain number of pages

00:09:14: It's true and it is not unlimited.

00:09:17: No, exactly so.

00:09:19: a lot of football clubs reach out to us And they are like oh we'd love to be in the map.

00:09:25: well you know that very nice but We also have...it has worked for us aswell.

00:09:30: So isn't as difficult As you might expect it.

00:09:35: Football club always kind of likes The idea people like having things In their hands which again I've said before.

00:09:40: But its true They just like it.

00:09:44: You could be the most jaded person in the world, but you feel a silly little kid again and you're like shit.

00:09:50: I'm in this!

00:09:51: It's good.

00:09:52: People not only want to have something on their hand they also want to wear something on your body as well.

00:09:56: And football shirts... The jerseys came more popular last couple of years especially through hip-hop culture Drake.

00:10:07: I would say Drake wearing

00:10:09: every other

00:10:10: people's shirt, maybe in the UK but Mundial before I joined there was a big part of that like bloke core and wearing retro football shirts with Jorts or so on and so forth But even bootleg tees that Mundial made.

00:10:28: they made a Lion shirt.

00:10:31: They made a Simpson shirt.

00:10:34: As you know, in the past few years like I'm wearing one today.

00:10:36: We did a shirt with daily paper which is a bit more fashion forward

00:10:40: on daily people.

00:10:41: Yeah.

00:10:41: Daily paper.

00:10:41: love Jefferson Love Abdulman.

00:10:43: They are great and to our more recent collaborations were like gorillas an outcast And King Giza and Lizard Wizard Which had he's gone.

00:10:53: now we had Jackson Jackson Irvine front-and-center?

00:10:55: i mean those Those where super cool but they Were not just isolated.

00:11:00: we didn't do them Just just to do them.

00:11:03: We did then because we thought the story behind each shirt, doing a football shirt was worth doing and that's the whole point.

00:11:11: you have to be intentional with these

00:11:12: things.".

00:11:13: When thinking about something like that in your already mentioned it is all about the storytelling.

00:11:17: what does the center of thoughts when... trying or producing something like that?

00:11:24: Or getting into the first ideas of something.

00:11:29: For me, when thinking about those kind of ideas it's either you have to work with someone who inspires a lot of devotion and people... ...or there might be design elements which remind them of their childhood nostalgia play or like human interests.

00:11:49: Like, you know we're doing this shirt with this band but they also... They are going to donate two hundred thousand pounds for their community football grassroots teams right?

00:11:59: So there is a utility to the shirt existing in and of itself by buying it.

00:12:06: You are saying that I support these guys.

00:12:08: i support what they stand for which is all about belonging.

00:12:12: really why buy any brands stuff.

00:12:17: Like, why buy Adidas?

00:12:18: Why buy Nike?

00:12:19: Why?

00:12:19: by Daily Paper you know apart from that fact it's good clothes.

00:12:22: but um It's because in every choice we make especially I believe this with like style is like You belong to a certain group.

00:12:31: if i choose To wear the football shirt With a card again and pair of superstars Um...it's Because I turned up here in a leather coat wearing black makeup.

00:12:45: You look alright, he's goth right these they are signifiers everything we put on our bodies or signifiers of what tribe We belong to and i think that is very true for the people who buy my stuff.

00:12:56: do you understand why especially football jerseys became such an important part For streetwear

00:13:04: yeah?

00:13:05: I wrote about this a while ago few years go but um I took first started with its origins.

00:13:10: like Football shirts have always been worn by fans, like as in the original fans.

00:13:18: Hardcore fans people who were casuals there with a burberry trench coat... These guys would do streetwear before streetwear I think because they identified themselves vividly with communities and club that they sprung from right?

00:13:39: proliferation of like, you know the internet and fashion designers all of a sudden getting involved with football culture.

00:13:45: And then it becomes more diffuse.

00:13:47: It becomes You know A fashion item...and then you get traditionalist being Like.

00:13:53: well what the fuck are you doing without heritage?

00:13:55: But..it's evolved in really interesting way.

00:14:00: I think I've forgotten actually What The Question was because i have gone on a massive tangent.

00:14:04: Oh about evolution of streetwear culture

00:14:07: Yes, and why The football jersey is playing such an important part.

00:14:12: People, I mean A they look cool and especially the older ones like they just simply aesthetically looked cool.

00:14:17: but people...

00:14:17: What's your favourite one?

00:14:19: My favorite apart this is genuinely one of my favourite shirts.

00:14:22: Like the

00:14:23: daily paper.

00:14:23: yeah collaboration.

00:14:25: But i think my favourite ever United shirt Is one that I own.

00:14:27: it's a Ewaica.

00:14:29: It's blue.

00:14:30: I can show you a photo!

00:14:32: It's

00:14:32: Blue?!

00:14:33: It's a blue away shirt

00:14:35: really.

00:14:36: It's some great photos of United Fans home and away, like getting into many scraps.

00:14:42: I am just slowing this down.

00:14:46: And

00:14:47: the sound that people might listen in between are... ...the sound checks on other stage for tomorrow's big neighborhood party.

00:14:56: so if there may be some distraction please bear with us guys!

00:15:01: There

00:15:02: is

00:15:02: a lot things going on.

00:15:04: Ah, yeah.

00:15:04: I do remember with Sharp was the sponsor back then and The Stripes because it's an Adidas shirt.

00:15:10: Yeah And he's got a trefoil and sublimated into this shirt.

00:15:14: It is MUFC up-and-down.

00:15:16: Oh,

00:15:16: yeah?

00:15:16: Yes!

00:15:17: I love

00:15:18: wearing...I wear it in quite a lot With this card.

00:15:19: it has been my favourite shirt All the time Basically..it looks very beautiful blue colour.

00:15:29: So you're totally right want to look cool and fly.

00:15:33: And I mean, wearing something on the street is a streetwear

00:15:36: footballs.

00:15:36: Yeah.

00:15:36: Football's popping right now in terms of its cultural relevance and like every single brand is releasing a football show like Guinness have released for past year again.

00:15:48: yeah i'm just gonna say it anyway because they're not their only examples but A collection with a British brand called Perseville who also make good clothes, but... ...who are friends of many others.

00:16:03: But the collection was good like functionally, it didn't have any meaning.

00:16:07: It was vacuumed and there were only two logos put together.

00:16:11: I don't know how to say this idea of what this is about, like Guinness.

00:16:17: If they'd done even a campaign video where they went to the Guinness brewery and dressed all the workers in their gear... It made it feel more rooted but it was so nebulous like Percival or London Brand, Guinness very Irish.

00:16:32: They did another thing with art football last year.

00:16:34: Again, they also make good clothes and not knock against them.

00:16:37: but it's like if Guinness instead went to Bohemians in Ireland and did a shirt with them immediately becomes more relevant.

00:16:44: right then all rights itself where you can do the campaign release.

00:16:47: would the locals down the pub who drink Guinness anyway?

00:16:50: Like everything become so much more natural than easy because he picked The Right Partner.

00:16:55: I think lots of people don't pick The Right Partners Traditional football fans who like I'm of them.

00:17:00: I get annoyed when people there are weird brand collaborations.

00:17:03: or I see, you know Kim Kardashian wearing a Manchester United shirt and I'm like well i'm from Manchester grew up twenty minutes more trafficked.

00:17:10: what the fuck do You have to deal with my football club?

00:17:12: Everyone will do that.

00:17:13: but if you pick Make it right choices.

00:17:19: That then People don't angry because It seems organic.

00:17:23: And Then If Your see someone who might not be a fan of Bohemians, walking around with a Bohemian Guinness shirt.

00:17:28: You're less likely to get angry because it's like... well fine let them wear it.

00:17:33: but if you see somebody wearing a menstrual stinger knighted kit and You ask them about their favorite players or whatsoever and they can't name anyone because I'm just liking the colors of the kid.

00:17:44: Or, my friends say it's cool isn't that same thing when someone is wearing a nirvana shirt?

00:17:52: Yeah

00:17:55: you can choose to get annoyed by this but...

00:17:58: But it's great that you say, You can't choose to do that because yeah of course.

00:18:02: No no

00:18:05: when I was younger i would definitely get annoyed by why the fuck especially with music?

00:18:10: I mean i love so many bands.

00:18:11: its like... I think back people still is like we did The King Giz shirt.

00:18:17: It sold out in four minutes.

00:18:18: cause king giz fans are maniacs best way possible But their fangirl would definitely be the kind of, if they saw someone on a street wearing that shirt.

00:18:26: They'd be like why are you wearing that?

00:18:28: Do you know who they are?

00:18:30: Again I think it's just...I think he should just be tolerant to people If they want to wear a Manchester United shirt.

00:18:39: i'm not going to lose sleep over it because Manchester United especially with Manchester United, Manchester United are basically The Beatles.

00:18:46: You know there so big.

00:18:47: If it was a really niche team, could be the thing is if he's in each team you expect to level of knowledge.

00:18:52: If someone was wearing red star Paris shirt I'd be like oh that's ball knowledge.

00:18:56: and also because even if you are not a fan or that so i would wear one.

00:18:59: You know what I mean?

00:19:00: Like then I'm no fun at Red Star.

00:19:01: live rail betty shirts cause I liked Hummel and they're at rail bettys.

00:19:08: I've never been to Seville Gotcha, so you could call me a hypocrite for doing that like.

00:19:15: I just think it looks cool and be Like.

00:19:17: i know about the club.

00:19:18: I liked their values life.

00:19:19: someone is going to buy red star parish shirt.

00:19:21: They obviously identify with this at.

00:19:22: someone bought a san paulish It.

00:19:25: they would identified because if you are the kind of person who buys a san palishe or your wear the jolly Roger on Your chest You're gonna Be up type A Person Who?

00:19:33: Know The type Of Person That Is far right rhetoric.

00:19:37: who's a pro immigration, all that kind of stuff is baked into the club's identity.

00:19:42: You don't need to be a fan at football clubs and you watch them week in week out with if you match their ethos.

00:19:49: There's

00:19:52: so much money in football especially in The Premier League when some investors come from outside putting money into it.

00:20:02: how do you see our clubs evolve?

00:20:07: It's not, I don't want to focus on like only the bad sides of things when money get into it because Of course everyone needs to earn money Because we all needed to live from it.

00:20:20: Of course, we have to deal with that as well.

00:20:25: But what I'm thinking about is these big clubs having an identity with a supporter club outside and then there comes investor who has nothing.

00:20:35: do anything just throwing money at them.

00:20:38: say next year you win the Champions League everything's fine.

00:20:43: This is not my identity, no.

00:20:45: Not because of more money but because the money's coming out from outside?

00:20:51: I just thought of Wolverhampton Wanderers and their foreign investment.

00:20:54: they obviously got relegated due to various mismanagement But it always causes a short term.

00:21:01: or Newcastle United for example with the Saudis like cause.

00:21:04: there was a short boost And then you hit war.

00:21:09: In those instances in two clubs Things just don't work out.

00:21:14: They plateau or they start to actually get worse and it's like, well You've essentially stripped away what is a community asset?

00:21:23: Trump pivoted towards the global audience or an American audience?

00:21:26: or you know Singaporean audience wherever And you'd not really looked after the people who go week in week out Who you know Don't have anything apart from their club especially if you look at that Newcastle.

00:21:39: It's been quite deprived part of London defy part of the United Kingdom with all due respect.

00:21:46: But like there are some awful parts, parts of Tyneside what do people who don't have anything apart from Newcastle United having common with a Saudi billionaire?

00:21:55: Absolutely nothing.

00:21:56: I think There's a lot.

00:21:57: psychological dissonance would support us because they will be like oh these guys are our saviours.

00:22:01: and then when it doesn't work out They're like why isn't it worked that?

00:22:04: also i don't recognize my football club anymore Because i can't afford to buy their tickets cause they've raised ticket prices all these various things.

00:22:14: I don't think foreign investment really, unless it's done with like prudent sporting directors...I think the clubs that do it correctly are like Brentford who basically hired a bunch of nerds to figure out how to run our football club correctly and they've just spammed their way into being an unbelievable football club.

00:22:36: fair play but If I look at the Premier League and compared to other leagues, money has had nothing but a corroding effect on spirit... ...and soul of English football.

00:22:50: Because it's not English anymore!

00:22:51: That makes me sound like i'm far right racist But obviously not.

00:22:56: There is a uniquely English atmosphere in games And that English adds into everyone.

00:23:02: I am A brown person Everyone when they say English.

00:23:07: It's so global now it can make those people who, you know Pay their tickets every single week or pay that season ticket to feel very small.

00:23:18: Do you like the English football most?

00:23:21: Aesthetically I love Spanish football in terms of light.

00:23:25: That loved a technique and The skill and then slight.

00:23:29: they don't have as much apart from the big three clubs.

00:23:30: if there's not it's not a way.

00:23:32: He's actually Not Very wealthy League is a very.

00:23:34: it's a wealthy league but he's not competitive Premier League But there's such a high technical standard across the board.

00:23:40: I mean, we were invited last year to La Liga Futures Mundial which again has Mundial in their name.

00:23:46: but those are these twelve-year olds who're all playing like unbelievable technique and skill.

00:23:51: so that...I love watching Spanish football English Football?

00:23:53: Yes!

00:23:54: I'll always love it because i grew up and its the club is the football that I loved most.

00:24:00: It's not necessarily pure highest form of game Like, especially that I watched less and lesser the Premier League now outside of Manchester United.

00:24:10: It's my job too so i will keep up to date with it.

00:24:13: but non-league football and like lower down is where...I think more of The Spirit Is At or you get?

00:24:18: Especially we'd like..you know non league football You have a bricklayer.

00:24:24: playing upfront would be like a former academy prospect Academy prospects who have just been released, who are like fifteen years old... ...have to play against a thirty-five year grown man.

00:24:33: The stadiums right in the middle of their communities and you can go up to them….

00:24:38: …and almost reach out touch with players.

00:24:40: it's a completely different world away from the Premier League.

00:24:44: The Premier League does invest in grassroots.

00:24:45: but that is what I like most about English football because he has that village spirit.

00:24:52: It has a sense Oh come on, we'll be fine.

00:24:57: You know like that keep calm and carry-on type thing I quite enjoy.

00:25:03: And you don't really get.

00:25:04: even at United Games where you know tourists can come.

00:25:07: it's fine.

00:25:07: all Trafford's a tourist attraction That's fine But its not the same.

00:25:11: The United is bit different maybe because i grew up there with people who are my family or friends from the same area.

00:25:19: So I still think United is a community club in many ways.

00:25:21: but Premier League is just big business man.

00:25:25: you can't form an emotional connection with donalds.

00:25:27: Yeah

00:25:28: that's a good take.

00:25:28: i mean it stuff because of course we all want to have the community and will have.

00:25:33: the identification was something really love and truly enjoy, we have to see which kind of direction it takes, because its the same thing with like a musician.

00:25:47: You love first record and you want... when second records sounds exactly the same.

00:25:50: but then you have to realize that person might change little bit And in this second record is still the same person.

00:25:57: But if don't like it doesn´t makes artist Worse.

00:26:00: Yeah, it's not your type anymore.

00:26:02: but of course if you... If your identity is part of like loving this kind of artist or coming back to football loving This kind of club and do lose in a way?

00:26:11: Of course It hurts.

00:26:12: yeah.

00:26:12: And I think it's very interesting To see how connected something Like that Is more with the person than the club these days.

00:26:21: At least this is my impression of things, that people are tending to be more fan-of a player instead being a fan-off

00:26:28: team.".

00:26:29: That's

00:26:29: very basketball yeah?

00:26:30: Yeah definitely!

00:26:31: It's what I want to say.

00:26:31: it's more basketball like oh someone who moves from X to Y then you're your fan off y but i'm not quite sure if thats tough because talking about right or wrong kind Is that right?

00:26:47: That you kind of say goodbye to the club, your love for last season just because players are moving.

00:26:53: I think Americans do it a lot more which Americans have strange breed in many regions

00:26:58: Of course at least with contracts You can like expire contract and then he's gonna move to another free agent

00:27:06: transfer.

00:27:07: And we've seen all other American sports

00:27:11: Crazy, but yeah.

00:27:15: I think it is accurate that people are following players much more even like in Bapay or Laminumal these guys.

00:27:22: But he was a lot more prevalent than the Ronaldo and Messi areas.

00:27:25: Like people would be Real Madrid fans because of Cristiano Ronaldo They'd beat Barcelona fans Because of Lionel Messi.

00:27:31: It's almost less prevalent now because we're in an era where that PSG team won two Champions Leagues in a row.

00:27:38: There wasn't Mandembele sure there were no standout player.

00:27:42: Really they're all kind of interchangeable interconnected, but the

00:27:46: or I mean play are also crazy level.

00:27:49: Yeah That's true

00:27:51: But I do agree with you there is tendency towards a more atomized individual fandom when it comes to football.

00:28:01: It's like I like.

00:28:02: Well, it's even United.

00:28:03: Okay I keep talking about Manchester now and I told you it stopped.

00:28:05: It

00:28:06: sounds like fine!

00:28:06: But he said I'll follow United because of Bruno... ...I will follow Real Madrid because i really liked Vinicius Jr.

00:28:14: or Namar.

00:28:14: there is Namar Stans that sort of stan culture a lot more prevalent.

00:28:21: yeah they have a friend who supports Tottenham just because she likes Musa Dembele which again is pretty a strange decision.

00:28:31: But yeah, there's.

00:28:34: I think it's quite strange but football is the team game though It's not like basketball.

00:28:40: so basketball was a team where there's one guy can be their guide because they're only five players on the court at one time.

00:28:47: There are eleven players in football and necessarily even prime Lionel Messi probably the most guy who could have the most impact on a game.

00:28:58: Even then you You could find a way to stop him from being as impactful.

00:29:02: But you can't really do that in basketball.

00:29:06: People say, you can choose your friends but it can't chose your club?

00:29:10: No I'd agree with...I would agree with that like.

00:29:13: i don't mind a person from Tennessee being an Juventus fan because they watched Alessandro Del Piero from very young age and fell in love with Torino and Italia And all that kind of stuff.

00:29:26: That's a valid thing to feel.

00:29:29: That's a valid thing to feel, either.

00:29:30: similar with basketball.

00:29:32: I've watched LeBron at Miami and I was like, I'm an army fan right?

00:29:35: And now you hate him seeing a Los Angeles Lakers in there.

00:29:40: Let's go talk about where he is going.

00:29:42: move next!

00:29:44: Philadelphia of course that's the way it goes...

00:29:48: I thought he would be back

00:29:51: To

00:29:51: Cleveland.

00:29:53: This is for you.

00:29:54: Crazy, but it's another narrative now?

00:29:56: Yeah

00:29:57: yeah very much different narrative ring chasing which again there's an other concept that with the

00:30:02: forty-one

00:30:03: year he sold his ancient.

00:30:07: What's up with that?

00:30:08: But he is playing on a better level than I do, so it was fine!

00:30:11: Yeah.

00:30:12: He'd play at the better level then me or you when he was eighty and that would be the odd stick we should measure

00:30:17: him in.

00:30:18: It gets.

00:30:18: so,

00:30:19: yeah... but yes, Messi yet thirty-nine still to go.

00:30:22: Again this really big football challenge which I didn't think i'll be doing.

00:30:26: but Messi is one of those guys who reminds us how it is being kid.

00:30:31: just amazing.

00:30:32: there's an uncannyness too.

00:30:33: I did that.

00:30:36: One of his passes was unheimlich, like Freud... That's stupid!

00:30:42: But it is uncanny, he's a kind of genius and can draw people in to the sport.

00:30:48: but yeah whichever way you find your club because there isn't any conscious decision i think..i'm not sure with lots online fans That's the sickness that I'll never lose.

00:31:06: Like, would I choose to be an England football fan?

00:31:08: No but from England.

00:31:10: so I'm going support England.

00:31:11: you know like...that is what it is.

00:31:14: and being interested people don't just- People..I guess Brazil is a national team that people

00:31:20: tend to like right now.

00:31:22: Yeah

00:31:22: yeah yeah But i've not...like.

00:31:25: yeah my ex girlfriend was Brazilian So I'd wear brazilian stuff.

00:31:28: but brazil or brazil are cool They're their global team.

00:31:32: really.

00:31:34: This podcast is called stands against the run.

00:31:37: so obviously there's something we are fighting for.

00:31:40: Yes,

00:31:41: what's the thing you're fighting?

00:31:43: four?

00:31:44: That's interesting.

00:31:45: What am I fighting for again?

00:31:48: I guess nuance against a guest.

00:31:50: I guess cultural literacy.

00:31:52: i think that sort of people become so reactionary now.

00:31:56: I heard it's actually one of the panels.

00:31:59: There was someone said that Gen Z do this, if you don't stick to your principles they'll drop you.

00:32:05: and i agree like...I mean..i have my principles but if you contravene them well go against.... I will be like okay this doesn't go against my beliefs but its more.

00:32:18: there is a reactionary element in that aswell right?

00:32:20: If u dont believe what ive believed then we can never talk reasonably, which I disagree with.

00:32:27: Someone could believe the complete opposite to me in.

00:32:30: like every single thing and i would try and understand them because we owe it do each other...to try and meet eachother at some point.

00:32:40: no one is an island or that kind of shit.

00:32:43: so i think people should be more nuanced and be willing to entertain uncomfortable conversations instead of being pulled apart.

00:32:55: The online ecosystem encourages being reactionary, being vitriolic.

00:33:01: Being like fuck you, fuck you... Whereas people aren't like that.

00:33:07: You could get two online trolls in a room with each other and then all of the sudden they're the meekest people in the world.

00:33:12: So I wish it just sounds very wishy-washy but i think we should listen to one another And i think is what im fighting for

00:33:20: great especially when we're talking about like having this podcast.

00:33:23: Yeah, I really appreciate us that.

00:33:26: thanks for taking the time.

00:33:27: things were giving us the insights and i've learned a lot about Manchester United today which is very

00:33:32: good Thanks.

00:33:34: This Is Against The Run the Podcast by Stan's.

00:33:36: my name is Amadeus Tuna And We Talk Until Next

00:33:43: Time!